Raids

[Relikk]

As Molten Core is starting up this week - I would like to see more donations of both your time and resources. When you give, you receive as well, and the difference can mean we progress further.

Toss a stack of candles to the priests and any other class that requires regeants. Shameless plug here, but if you have any dreamfoil send it my way and I will make the FR pots to send to Maube, or you can purchase FR pots for the raid so as to save those resources. Two stacks (10 total) of FR pots should be in your bag when you show up for Molten Core.

One more thing: Start to think about how we can save time. Not a word should be issued from our beloved commander in cheiftess when a surger comes rushing into our raid party when we are already engaged with Molten Destroyers. Warlocks banish immediately and hunter's pets with taunt already going after it should be standard protocol, and helpful if a warlock be unable to banish it. Priests who aren't covering the MT's should already have a bubble on the warlock. What we want are proactive players who think ahead and ensure the safety and survivability of our raids. I would love to see more flawless victorys, save for the customary sacrificial Scryll death which enhances item drops Keep in mind folks, everyone is doing an excellent job, and I see warlocks already doing a great job of doing this, just want to make sure they continue to do a great job without being nervous and that they will have the coverage they require when performing those actions. Same thing, if two giants rush at us, I have no problem if Zak, Cwn, lomar or any other tank battles for it's attention. Just remember that the MT's healers and backup healers may not be ready for all that damage you are taking, so toss up a shield wall and have a macro ready that *you* require heals, and all that shaman, druid and priest lubbin will come your way =)

**

Tank rotations - We will be doing more of this in the future. Send me an email in game if you want to tank, let me know what your stats are (FR, Defense, spec etc). Alhazad will continue to be a main tank until he doesn't want to do it anymore, I will rotate my position out so that everyone get's a chance. I just need to talk to Maube about this.

**

Also wanted to suggest a strategy that other guilds use in Molten Core to save time. What other top guilds are doing (when their MC raid is split into two days like ours) is clear the bosses up to and including Shazz. Then, leave three players in the tunnel between Garr's room and Shazz. These three are 1 warlock and 2 others (doesn't matter what class) that do not leave the raid. The tunnel will be empty as there is only 1 core hound that patrols that tunnel, and since that core hound is dead (as well as Mags), the core hound will not respawn.

The three volunteers for this would be unable to use that particular character on Thursday, as it must stay in the tunnel and in the raid. A warlock would be required to have enough summoning shards for 37+ players, or we could have two warlocks to split the difference. I would be willing to assist summoning, I'll just play an alt on Thursday. This would mean that we would be at Sulfuron within 20 mins, and I would guess we would be at Ragnaros by 10 p.m.

Of course, we would have to clear the entrance to rags, but that's a short run anyways, and we usually end up doing that anyways.

Big hug to all,

Rel

p.s. I want to remind you all to be polite and respectful to each other. I have very little tolerance for rude people that had no real justification for being mean and nasty. If you have questions or concerns, please let the raid leaders know and be polite about it.

[Wendie]

Relikk has a lot of really good ideas here.

For time saving as well we need to get into the habit of chain pulling. most people in the runs have done this long enough that assignments don't need to be called out every time. If everyone is up and most people have mana, trash mobs will be pulled. if 4 people are still sitting and healing up during a trash mob fight that's fine but it saves having to wait for them to be healed before we pull.

[Maube]

::nods:: we had chainpulling started but then slacked off due to our raid burnout.

swapping tanks is an EXCELLENT idea, getting everyone who is a tank a feel for it so incase something happens and our three regulars cant make it we arent left high and dry

Trash mobs at 20% pull the next one, secondary tank be ready to pick it up Giants MT is always on left OT always on right, and we CAN use innervate on trash fights no reason not to!

Ohand I nominate Vrugz for sitting in the tunnel =p

[Oriahtundra]

Lock idea is awesome, just have gotta get a volunteer. Permission to Innervate the rogues and wars on trash fights granted 10-4 chiefy

[Waldonnis]

Better to park two warlocks up there with one other, if possible, to lessen the shard count that any one would need to stash. Waldonnis doesn't get out much and doesn't have enough room for 37 shards, but I could probably stash 15-20 (easily gathered in the Gorge). Getting three people to dedicate mains to sitting in the tunnel may be difficult, though (two, if Waldonnis is used), since those are probably their best-geared and most capable toons for other instances or uses...

Also, the better bet is to keep clearing to Sulf if possible, or push hard to clear Golemagg as well. Stopping at Shaz is like adding at least one extra boss to the list for the second day, leaving less time for the FR buffs and attempts.

Before thinking down that path, though...realise that we'd be foregoing some BoE drops that can be traded or used to further benefit the raid, as well as a few lava/fiery cores. There are still plenty of people that do not have every Tier 1 BoE available and they'd be making a bigger sacrifice than those with them.

[Tainish]

Or if you park just one lock make sure your first two or three summons are locks and you're in business.

And they tell two friends...

And they tell two friends...

and so on and so on and so on...

[Relikk]

That was one of my considerations Waldonnis, however, my concern is progressing further and graduating from Molten Core via taking Ragnaros down, which achieves multiple objectives, aside from being a big moral booster.

Players want to see more content in the game. For those interested in BOE items - which we will continue to obtain each week anyway - they either have the option of joining BOE crusades to MC, or consider extending their MC raiding beyond that of a normal raid schedule.

Rel

[Martok]

Vrugz in the tunnel? O.o

[Waldonnis]

That was one of my considerations Waldonnis, however, my concern is progressing further and graduating from Molten Core via taking Ragnaros down, which achieves multiple objectives, aside from being a big moral booster.

Players want to see more content in the game. For those interested in BOE items - which we will continue to obtain each week anyway - they either have the option of joining BOE crusades to MC, or consider extending their MC raiding beyond that of a normal raid schedule.

Rel

Guess I'll be on those BoE crusades...along with a good chunk of the raid. Is there some big rush to the finish line going on that nobody mentioned to me before as a participant in the raid? Perhaps it's time I rethink why I'm in Molten Core, because I thought it was for fun with others, not some insane progression pace that leaves many to flounder in relative "crusade" PuGs or a second raid for their gear.

Look, I agree that killing Ragnaros will be a big morale booster, and I'm all for getting as many attempts as possible at him, but my concerns are stability of raid participation and gear improvement overall (making for better attempts). The more geared we all are, the easier it becomes, as we've seen so far. I just wanted to point out that we'd be sacrificing some opportunity for the sake of time...and I'm personally not sure it's worth it at this stage.

Oh, and you never "graduate" from MC...we'll all end up back in there time and time again. I know people that have been trying for the better part of a year to get their pants from Rags...

[Scryll]

That was one of my considerations Waldonnis, however, my concern is progressing further and graduating from Molten Core via taking Ragnaros down, which achieves multiple objectives, aside from being a big moral booster.

Players want to see more content in the game. For those interested in BOE items - which we will continue to obtain each week anyway - they either have the option of joining BOE crusades to MC, or consider extending their MC raiding beyond that of a normal raid schedule.

Rel

Guess I'll be on those BoE crusades...along with a good chunk of the raid. Is there some big rush to the finish line going on that nobody mentioned to me before as a participant in the raid? Perhaps it's time I rethink why I'm in Molten Core, because I thought it was for fun with others, not some insane progression pace that leaves many to flounder in relative "crusade" PuGs or a second raid for their gear.

Look, I agree that killing Ragnaros will be a big morale booster, and I'm all for getting as many attempts as possible at him, but my concerns are stability of raid participation and gear improvement overall (making for better attempts). The more geared we all are, the easier it becomes, as we've seen so far. I just wanted to point out that we'd be sacrificing some opportunity for the sake of time...and I'm personally not sure it's worth it at this stage.

Oh, and you never "graduate" from MC...we'll all end up back in there time and time again. I know people that have been trying for the better part of a year to get their pants from Rags...

I understand the hesitancy, V, but... wasn't part of the reason we initiated things like chain-pulling because we viewed the idea of clearing MC in one day as a good thing? As much as we all like each other and love doing things like MC as a group, two four-hour chunks is hefty and fairly inflexible scheduling committment, particularly for those with families (and graveyard shift jobs, which I recall at least two of our regular priests have). This isn't a one-day approach, of course, but innovations like the summon thing strike me as giving us more breathing room and that seems to me to be more sane, pace-wise.

[Waldonnis]

*sighs* Point was missed again...

I'm not criticising it...hell, I offered to sacrifice Waldonnis to *help* with it. My point is that we'll be making a trade-off and I want that understood. My umbrage was to the raid progression comments, not the summoning idea. I didn't join a raiding guild and it's starting to feel like I did. Yeah, still a bit crispy about last night's Ony...

Meh, I give up...I'll park my entire 60 family in that tunnel if it's desirable.

[Martok]

*Uglutz scratches his head*

Wut wuz point again? Me lub mud pie!

[Relikk]

I use the term 'graduation' to reflect that we have defeated all bosses in MC.

It does not mean we will be finished, and as to how long we do MC it is not my decision. However, it is my intent to do Molten Core for a very long time, my expectation is that I will probably doing MC for another six months as I enjoy it. Like you said, tier 2 legs drop there, and that means approx 40 more weeks. Imagine, 40 more weeks, with some weeks producing 2 to 9 BoE drops!

I think we have the same idea to be honest, and sadly, I think that we will begin to disenchant BoP items and selling the rest while everyone has 8/8 and is working on getting the tier 2 legs and various other new items ragnaros drops

If people do not want to perform the summoning option, I have no objection to grinding all the way back to Shazz's room on Friday night. It is of my opinion though, that we will achieve the BoE objectives you mentioned in due time.

Option 1: Summoning to the tunnel for Friday night

Pros: a) Saves alot of time, skips half of the entire instance of trash mobs. b) Sulfuron, Golemagg and Majordomo down within 1 to 2 hours.

c) Expect to be at Ragnaros with buffs by between 10 and 10:45, with a second shot possible.

d) possible BoE drops between main entrance and ragnaros

Cons: a) Less chance for BoEs

Perhaps I am biased, I really hate ending the night with only 1 shot on a boss and failing, or having some players log off and not be a part of this momentus event due to work concerns. I would rather have 2 or even 3 shots at it.

Please feel free to discuss further and then Maube can let us know either way. We can always give it a try and see how it works out, and whether it is worth it or not.

Rel

[Maube]

While that is an idea Relikk... I think right now, we need as much practice as we can get. We still wipe on trash and we still need a LOT of the Cores to get FR up.

If we cant get chain pulling down on both days... how is starting with Lava packs going to help us? we warm up on the 'easy' trash and then get the harder stuph.

The more practice we get on chain pulling and healing rotations the better we will be in the end.

All this 'pugging' lately and loot obsession is turning people into not the type that should be in Clan Skullcrusher. While I am glad we got down Onyxia last night... I did hear about lack of respect given to Crusher elders by 'guests' and Crushers a like and that does not sit well with me.

Didnt see the two people who got their helms last week which reminds me why I dont like pugging. They are there for loot and not the victory. People who stick it out week after week after week are those who should get priority, but people who come in once, grab some loot adn leave never to be seen from again is frustrating to many of us who have paid our repair bills learning the bosses.

[Odenn]

Do we want to resurect the DKP system for Ony or switch to a DKP free with minimum attendance type of situation.

[Maube]

I think the minimum attendance should be a good thing... at loeast for Ony... people come 2 or 3 weeks - Small amount but it helps

[Scryll]

Do we want to resurect the DKP system for Ony or switch to a DKP free with minimum attendance type of situation.

The problem with that is that our sign-ups/people who actually make it online are still a bit low. We need to pick up others most weeks, and it's harder to do that when we're running DKP and/or minimum attendance.

[Relikk]

While that is an idea Relikk... I think right now, we need as much practice as we can get. We still wipe on trash and we still need a LOT of the Cores to get FR up.

If we cant get chain pulling down on both days... how is starting with Lava packs going to help us? we warm up on the 'easy' trash and then get the harder stuph.

The more practice we get on chain pulling and healing rotations the better we will be in the end.

All this 'pugging' lately and loot obsession is turning people into not the type that should be in Clan Skullcrusher. While I am glad we got down Onyxia last night... I did hear about lack of respect given to Crusher elders by 'guests' and Crushers a like and that does not sit well with me.

Didnt see the two people who got their helms last week which reminds me why I dont like pugging. They are there for loot and not the victory. People who stick it out week after week after week are those who should get priority, but people who come in once, grab some loot adn leave never to be seen from again is frustrating to many of us who have paid our repair bills learning the bosses.

The issue with Onyxia bothers me as well. Sleyvas said the same thing, and he was right. Players who get their head piece then never show up again really bother me too, especially if they get it on their very first visit.

Rel

[Crikrunner]

Crikrunner will gladdly sit in the tunnel on weeks I can make the friday raid.

Also you just need to summon the other warlocks first then you dont need 37 shards on the first one. All the one sitting in the tunnel needs is 1 or more. The loks on the outside can go farm up the 37+ on thursday/friday.