Onyxia aggro

[Scryll]

I don't know how much this can be trusted, or whether we can think of a way to use it if it is. But it's a very interesting explanation, I think.

WoW Raid forum

After a lengthy discussion ongoing for the past month on the nature of the mysteries of Onyxia's threat mechanic from Phase 2 to Phase 3, Kenco (author of KTM) was able to determine that Onyxia's fireballs are an aggro wipe (whether its a full wipe or a high % wipe is yet to be determined, but it appears to be a full wipe) that begins at the top of the threat list and starts working its way down. After proposing this, numerous guilds went back and examined old videos or visited Ony themselves and confirmed the mechanic.

Kenco's post on the mechanic:

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Q u o t e:

WOW, i think i have it. I'm looking at the fraps of the run which i posted about earlier. In phase 2, Onyxia fireballs people on her threat list from the top down! Then the next 4 people after that were the ones who pulled aggro in phase 3!!

Here's the order of people she targets in phase 2 for fireballs, and their position on KTM, assuming fireball is a threat wipe:

#2

#2

#3

#1

#3

#2

#1

#2

#1

#1

?? (no KTM)

#2

#1

#2

#1

#2, then phase 3 starts, and then the 4 people on top are the guys who pulled aggro.

In other words, within errors on KTM, it's #1, and full wipe. Can't wait to test this out!

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And some further reasoning from Gurghthok of what the implications of this are:

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Q u o t e:

It also explains why, seemingly paradoxically, getting Ony to stick seems to get harder as one's raid gear improves, whereas when you 10-man her it's a nonissue. It's because with a small raid or a low-DPS raid she gets to fireball-wipe almost everyone, whereas if you quickly burn her out of the sky, some random priest or something won't have been wiped at all and will have substantial aggro left over.

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Q u o t e:

There's no global aggro wipe, it seems. When she takes off she starts wiping the threat of the top-aggro person in the raid and works her way down. If you burn her from 65 to 40 quickly and she only wipes the top 10 people before landing, then odds are some healer who may have 10k aggro is going to have Onyxia stick to him pretty strongly on landing because he has his full phase 1 threat carrying over.

[Halamesh]

Scryll, mon... dat discussion we had about da Masishu pulling aggro in pahse 3 for 5 seconds - without dying or anyone else doing so beacuse of it - this could easily be the reason, as I know full well I was happy that time not having been hit by a fireball

[Waldonnis]

I have my doubts about how total the threat wipe is with a fireball, but it sounds consistent with what I've noticed (if it weren't, I'd be the very first person she goes for when she lands almost every time). What I'm curious to see is, if I stop casting after being whacked by a fireball, would I be effectively off of the threat list for phase 3. If this is the case, then a shift in tactics may make the transition much easier (although it would take a bit more time to get her to land).

Assuming this is how threat works the way they suspect it does, it seems like one change that can be tried is similar to what we do now, but with a bit more coordination. Basically have the classes that do heavy ranged damage but have no threat wipe abilities (mages, warlocks) start heavy and lighten their damage as phase 2 progresses, while classes with partial or full threat wipes (hunters) start slow and progressively increase their damage throughout phase 2 (autoshots at first and ending with a rapid fire/trinket/full shot rotation going). Priests should likely be fading as much as the cooldown will allow throughout that phase and healing druids should be shifting to cat and cowering near the transition (aside from tranquil air, shaman are kinda screwed, unfortunately).

With any luck, fireballs would have wiped enough threat from the mages and warlocks, hunters will have feigned just prior to or at the time of her landing for phase 3, and priests/druids should be low enough threat-wise so that it's easy for a warrior to get her attention and hold it. She seems to like totems more than shaman, so they will likely not attract much attention.

Like I said, I'm not totally convinced that their theory is correct, but it does generally line up with what I've noticed on our successful and unsuccessful runs. Could be worth a try if we're up for it. I'll look into modifying KLH Threat Meter to test out this theory, if we decide to do it.

[Baracko]

Maybe we should talk Vrugz into changing classes and becoming a tank...

That way, we could really distract her with his smell and take her down quickly. Of course, she might be more likely to deep breath considering she would need to get that foul taste out of her mouth after nibblin on him. *gags*

[Waldonnis]

Maybe we should talk Vrugz into changing classes and becoming a tank...

That way, we could really distract her with his smell and take her down quickly. Of course, she might be more likely to deep breath considering she would need to get that foul taste out of her mouth after nibblin on him. *gags*

Why do you think she does those deep breaths now? She's obviously trying to clear out the taste and smell after phase one!

[Scryll]

Threatmeter's code was changed to kick in a -threat mechanic after you're targetted and hit by one of her fireball's as of the version before 2.0, Waldy. I don't know just how it works, the only time I've run her since then, my threatmeter was screwy. I do think Kenco is wrong and that the fireball is certainly not a total wipe. Going by earlier runs, I'm normally near the top of her aggro list at the end of phase 1, and I often pick up her attention and get fireballed twice during phase 2 if she's up in the air for any length of time (which isn't all that often, these days). Since I'm rarely doing anything which would garner any +threat during that period, I can't see how a total wipe would explain it.

And Halamesh, if you'd vanished anytime during Phase 2 or 3, not getting hit by a fireball wouldn't have mattered.

Edited December 20, 2006 by Scryll